Typical discourse with a gun control fan

Arguing logic, law and Constitutionality with a card-carrying member of the gun control camp, is usually about as productive as trying to piss up a rope, but I had some free time the other day.

Gun control fanboy:

So what can be done?

First, universal background checks must be strictly enforced, and connected to a nationwide database. Gun purchasers should be screened for prior convictions of violent crimes, especially domestic violence. Gun purchasers should be screened for mental health issues. Mental health providers should be required to flag patients with mental health issues that make them a danger to themselves or others. The U.S. military and the VA should be required to flag all soldiers who are being treated for PTSD or other mental disorders that make them a danger to themselves or others.

Second, all guns should be licensed. All new purchases should have a seven- to fourteen-day waiting period, allowing sufficient time for background checks to be performed. A database of those who purchased and those who own guns should be available to law enforcement.

Third, all open-carry and concealed-weapon laws should be repealed, putting an end to the Wild West mentality in many states and communities. Only law enforcement should be permitted to carry firearms in public.

Fourth, the manner in which the government and insurance companies handle mental health treatment must be changed in ways that make it possible for people to get prompt, ongoing, and comprehensive care.

Fifth, school leaders must address the ongoing bullying crisis in public schools. Teachers must be taught to be aware of bullying and to take steps to stop it when they see it happening.  While I suspect it is impossible to put an end to cliques, schools must do a better job of fostering inclusiveness. Perhaps it is time to put an end to the jocks-rule mentality that dominates most schools.

Sixth, semi-automatic firearms such as the AR-15 should be immediately banned. Any firearm capable of firing large-volume bursts should be banned. There is no legitimate reason for anyone to own military-style firearms.

Seventh, large (high) capacity magazines and clips should be immediately banned. There is no legitimate need for owning guns with large-capacity magazines, nor is there any reason for owning clips holding dozens of rounds of ammunition. It also goes without saying that bump stocks such as the ones used in the Las Vegas massacre should be outlawed.

Eighth, politicians should be banned from taking financial or in-kind donations from the NRA and the gun lobby. The NRA, along with the Ted Nugents of the world, are part of the problem. These promoters of the means of violence should not be given larger-than-life influence over the political process. (As my editor mentioned to me, this would surely not pass constitutional challenge. Fine. Let’s reverse the effects of Citizens United. Let’s make public the names of ALL campaign donors. Let’s ban corporate donations, soft money, and the other endless ways politicians hide who and where donations are coming from. In fact, let’s federally fund elections and limit campaigning as Great Britain does to a short time before time election day. In other words, GET THE FUCKING MONEY OUT OF POLITICS!)

My response:

I can appreciate the emotion after events where people have lost their lives, but we should always strive to be factually correct, no? Unless of course disinformation is the goal, which many in the gun control camp have proven themselves (in their own words) complicit in.

AR pattern rifles (of which their are many, many varieties of) don’t fire any faster than any other semi-automatic firearm, the rate of fire is how fast you pull the trigger…..as with any semi-automatic firearm. Semi-automatic firearms also don’t fire “large volume bursts”. Nor, if you’ve read some other media falsehoods recently, do they render hunted animals ‘destroyed’. As evidenced by the many thousands who hunt with AR pattern rifles. But I mean, hey…..if you want to ban the AR-15 and call it a day, I could almost get behind that. Since it wouldn’t affect my AK or Galil.

And “legitimate reason”? I can come up with a hundred. It’s beyond absurd to me that you would grant the State the power to dictate what a Citizen has a “legitimate reason” in owning something explicitly tied to a Constitutional Right.

Now, I largely agree with your statement on background checks. However, they are already tied to a national system (NICS). It’s the individual states and localities that have been failing to submit information to the DOJ, that would prevent many of these criminal shooters to legally acquire a firearm. The only means to enforce ‘universal’ background checks however, is a firearm registry….which aside from being a pipe dream, wouldn’t net nearly half of the legally owned firearms in this country. I have unkind words for anyone whop would deny a Veteran the Right to Keep and Bear Arms, due to a PTSD rating.

I think open carry is foolish, but open and concealed should be legal. Yes, bullying on school should be punished. Parents should also teach their kids to defend themselves. Bullying isn’t remotely new. People committing suicide pr conducting a mass shooting, is.

Magazines. Here we go again with “legitimate need”. Whatever number you’d offer as the top end would be arbitrary and undefendable other than the emotion behind the offer. Gun owners already have broad definition of standard capacity and high capacity. We’re good with that.

But….I’m perfectly fine with the gun control camp directing all of their ire against the NRA. That organization is corrupt and ineffective. State-based groups and national ones like SAF and GOA are far, far more effective in the legislative and judicial realm.

This nation is trying to put a band-aid on a problem that isn’t the guns (which are more difficult to acquire than at any time in our nations history). The problem is the self entitled, leisure pursing society that cares more about disposable consumer goods and social media distractions, than they do parenting or protecting their families.

And the expected response:

I don’t argue back and forth with gun nuts. Disparage me by calling me irrational or acting emotionally—who wouldn’t after countless mass shootings?— I don’t care. Guns are the problem. We must do whatever is necessary to regulate and control firearms. Until we do, the slaughter will continue.

And:

Yes, we are coming for your guns.

Facts and logic aren’t necessary when all you need is emotion, right?

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